165: Instructional Design and Speaking (ft. Vanessa Alzate)
Are you creating educational content for your business? Whether it's educational posts online courses dive deep programs. As a subject matter expert, sometimes we are just a little too close to our work to create educational content that creates real change for our audience. In today's episode, I have brought in instructional designer Vanessa Alzate to show us exactly how to create high value educational content, that creates real change.
If you loved this episode and it motivated you to work on more polished presentations, I’d love for you to leave a review on iTunes and tell me about your biggest takeaway. Take a screenshot of you listening on your device, post it to your Instagram Stories, and tag me @jessicarasdall.
Resources mentioned in this episode:
Meet Vanessa Alzate
Vanessa Alzate, is the Founder/CEO of Anchored Training. She received a BA in Communication & Political Science from Rutgers University, and a MS in Corporate & Organizational Communication from Northeastern University. For over a decade, she has worked in many industries ranging from pharma to fashion to develop instructional strategies unique for them. You can find her on YouTube talking about Instructional Design - her channel name is Vanessa Anchored.
In her spare time, Vanessa enjoys spending time with family dancing to 90s freestyle, and is committed to empowering women and advancing belonging.
How Experts Train Others
You can be the subject matter expert in your field, but do you know how to convey your knowledge to an audience? We have to stop trying to train someone on your level and train your audience. The first step in doing this is getting to know your audience.
Understanding Your Audience
Your audience is the only person that matters when you’re building a training or talk, because they’re the ones you want to impact with your talk. A few things you need to consider when learning about your audience include:
Accessibility for who you’re talking to
Can you convey your message in 3 slides?
Who is it and how do they learn
In order to get to the core, you have to strip out the fluff. You cannot simply do what’s easiest for you, you have to do what’s best for the audience.
Once you nail down your audience and how to connect with them you’re set. If you're trying to talk to everyone, you're talking to no one.
Creating Learner Personas
All of Vanessa’s clients go through a phase of creating learner personas, which is where they do surveys of your audience to learn about them and find words they’re using.
Once completed, she maps out these personas to nail down exactly who you need to be talking to and how they learn best. These are provided to clients to continue to reference so they’re continuing to develop and build trainings and presentations that communicate directly with the audience.
Testing Before Launching
One way you can ensure you’re talking to your audience is to test your talk or your program. It’s important to do your due diligence in your work when you're creating it, but also test it through a beta, pilot, or test program.
Mistakes in Creating Educational Content
not knowing who the learner is
not accepting that the modern workforce is changing
Is there a better way?
Look at the way you’re currently doing things in your talks and trainings. Is there a better way. You’ve heard about learning styles, right? The reality is, they don’t exist. What we’re talking about is preferences. You have to create opportunities for implementation.
While you may think about doing it the easiest way, there may be a better, more impactful way you should be considering.
If you're not already a member of the academy, we'd love to invite you to apply to join The Speaking Strategy Academy. You'll get instant access to our A-Z speaking training system with video lessons, transcripts, scripts, templates, and more.... access to our live group coaching calls, personalized 1:1 feedback on your work from me, and an opportunity to present your work live in front of our community for hot seat coaching and feedback. What are you waiting for, friend? Apply today!
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Review the Transcript for this Episode
Transcript for Episode 165:
Jessica Rasdall
Are you creating educational content for your business? Whether it's educational posts online courses dive deep programs. As a subject matter expert, sometimes we are just a little too close to our work to create educational content that creates real change for our audience. In today's episode, I have brought in an instructional designer to show us exactly how to create high value educational content, that creates real change.
Welcome back to another episode of The speak to scale Podcast, where we help business owners just like you grow and scale their company by speaking on stages, podcasts, webinars, and more. I'm your host, Jessica Rasdall. And I am so grateful that you are here today. I know there are so many other podcasts you could be listening to. And I'm grateful that you've chosen this one to come back to just like, there are so many different podcasts, there are so many educational resources.
And if you're somebody who already has an online course, or a coaching program, or creates YouTube videos, or creates any kind of how to type of content, you might be feeling like, there are so many other courses out there, or there's so many other resources just like what you offer. So how do we create educational content that moves the needle in our business, but also truly helps our audience, you know, create change and have a transformation. It's not a very big secret that a lot of courses in the online space, don't actually get finished. And if I don't get finished, I mean, people don't use them. They the marketing was great. Maybe you've purchased a course or two that just collecting virtual dust on your computer, but you never really got out of it what you were hoping to get. Why is that? Well, I'm a firm believer, and I talk about it a little bit today on the podcast that a lot of us when we go into the market of creating resources, we are taught how to market it really well. But maybe we haven't been taught how to create it really well. So on today's episode, I have brought in a very good friend. And I'm super honored to say also a client of mine, Vanessa latte who is been a longtime listener of the podcast, I think that's how we actually got connected. But she is an instructional designer. And she is a genius when it comes to not just creating content that we think is good, but creating content that is creating change for our audience. And I asked her to come on the show today because when I got to work with her, behind the scenes on her business on her speaking strategy, you know, when I'm working with somebody one on one, I need to learn everything that they do so that I can turn around and turn that into a high value presentation that showcases her, you know, her unique positioning and her approach and her framework, but also connects with her audience and helps her reach her speaking goals. And with Vanessa, I, my mind was blown in working with her like her subject matter expertise on this subject, her heart for creating high value learning content was unlike anything I'd ever experienced. And I knew I needed to bring her here onto the show so that you guys could absorb this because she brings the same strategies that she is using in large companies and organizations to create, you know, educational trainings that make an impact to our small business space so that we can uplevel our content so we can elevate education as a whole in our industry. So if you're wondering why people aren't completing your programs, why things are falling flat, why things are not as engaging as they used to be. I want you to grab a pen because Vanessa is breaking down, how we can figure out what kind of content we need to create how to stay in the right mindset throughout the whole process and really how to uplevel and stay ahead of the learning curve here. Because if there's one thing our industry does not need, it's more watered down courses. People want hands on learning that helps them create real change. And if you're ready to create something like that for your audience, today's episode is for you.
Jessica Rasdall
Listening to the podcast is a great first step, but I want you to go take action. So if you are ready to apply everything you've learned Hear on the show. Listen up, we took all of our best resources, like our plug and play crafting your story workbook, or how to select your speaking topics, workbook resources on crafting your talk, finding and pitching events, we put them all together inside of the speak to scale vault, and we put them in order, so you know exactly what to do and when to do it. to scale your business with speaking, ready to unlock the entire vault, head on over to speak to scale vault comm or click the link in our show notes. But be sure to use the code podcast for a special discount for me.
Jessica Rasdall
Okay, so give us a quick little rundown about who you are, or your company, what you do, we want to hear it all.
Vanessa Alzate
Hi, yeah, so I own anchored training, we create custom Training Solutions for medium sized businesses that want to keep the learner at the heart of their engagements. But that are also ready to try new things. So whether we're really embracing Tick tock, and Instagram reels as a learning method, we're really embracing interactive ways, the outside of the box interactive ways outside of your breakout rooms in a virtual setting of like how to really engage your training class. And I got started in the field in 2009. very differently than most, most people fall into instructional design, because they were really good at something. I had a few opportunities in college where I ended up creating some training. And I remember my fraternity and sorority advisor, put together this training for our recruitment counselors, and she looked at it and she was like, you can do better. She's like, this is 1.0, you're so much better than that. And that was the spark that I needed. And I was like, Wait, can this be a career? Can this be my thing. And I graduated during the economic crash of 2008, which is a horrible time to graduate that way. And I just was plugging keywords into anything that I liked. And one of the things was training, I ended up at a software training company. And that's where I really learned everything I learned how to engage a classroom, right? The different types of learners that you'll have in your class, and the different types of ways you can learn, right? whether it's online, in a class, virtually through a manual or quick reference card. And throughout my career, I think for like a hot minute, I thought I should go into HR, because that's kind of like what you do as like a female, right. And my husband had a plumbing company, and I thought, Okay, well, I'll be the one that supports him. And I will go to this ended up at a home remodeling company, as our office manager, I'm like, I'm gonna go there, learn some stuff that I could apply it to his company, but then I started missing training a lot. And so I went back to training. And I had two kids within a year. And I had been freelancing since about 2011. So this is like 2017. And it started becoming full time. So I was working full time, freelancing full time, which is like cool when you don't have when you don't have kids are so close in age. So I decided to just do the freelance thing, right. And I created a company name, because that's what you do. And then slowly but surely, I started realizing how much of I liked being a boss, I liked being a CEO, I liked running a business. And I wasn't going to be support staff for someone else, right, I wasn't going to be maybe like a VP, somewhere, I was going to be the main one, right. And, and I just saw this need in the industry where we weren't evolving with our learning and our training, it was super static. And I wanted to create the opportunity to bridge some of that old in that said that old and new, right. And I actually talked a lot about this, and that we can honor our past principles, but bring into the modern age. And people are really noticing that with like my marketing content in this field that it's very difficult to different style. And that's because I like to bridge that old in that nail. So that's a lot about me, but that's me.
Jessica Rasdall
I love it, though. I've loved seeing the like what I think of instructional design, especially with some of these companies that you work with, I think of old school stuff. And you don't do any of that, right. Like you guys are bringing a fresh approach, but also right there. A lot of times, companies, the people who are creating these educational resources within their company, or for their audience, whatever it may be, I think a lot of times we forget that our audience may be younger or more tech savvy than we are and we're We're trying to create something that meets our needs and not their needs. How do you see that play out?
Vanessa Alzate
Like you really touched on feelings that I had. So, we work with a lot of subject matter experts. And these are people that are really smart and what they know. But they are not as in tune with how to convey that knowledge to their audience. And when they create training, that's why you see a whole bunch of text on the screen, because they are speaking to themselves, they are writing that content or putting together that training presentation. And so when I work with a company, and we really push our blueprint process, because I really do believe in like knowing more about the learner, knowing more about the audience who's actually taking this training, and I remind my clients all the time, I'm not writing this for you, I'm writing this for your, for who's actually going to be in my class. And we really dive into who is the learner? How do they like to learn? What are their preferences, right? What's their access, going to be to training, so we work with some international organizations where they don't have great internet access, so I can't use a lot of video, or I work with, you know, my sorority. And so I know that a lot of people that are taking the training or collegians they're taking, you know, they're in college, they're taking training on their phone, so I need to make it mobile accessible for them are just responsive. So those are things we really think about. But what I also really love when I work with sneeze is I like to give them the when we're doing like a knowledge transfer session, and they're training me on everything. Like Okay, that was really great. Here are three slides. Give me what you want to give me in three slides. I then they freeze. Oh, I love that. Yeah. And they freeze, and they get nervous because they want to put everything in the kitchen sink. And I'm like, No, no, no, we have to strip out the fluff. And just really get to what the core messages and everything else can be added in other ways later, or training that can be opted into. But just so you know, these three things that you just told me, that's really what they need to know, everything else is just nice to know. And that's why I actually really enjoy this whole Tick tock, Instagram real thing, because you only have a certain amount of time to get your message across. And so how can you do that. And it really has been challenging, like our clients and us to really think about how to do that. So I think first and foremost, you want to make sure that you're really surveying your audience. And who's gonna be taking the learning, and take that step back? and really think about what's best for them, not what's easiest for you.
Jessica Rasdall
And okay, so I love this. This is why it's been so fun to work with you. Because, you know, it's very similar approach with speaking and you you just understand that, that it's not about you, right, it's about the person who's receiving the message. And also, you're just the best. But like, when, when I would assume that this is one of those things of like creating it for our consumer, not for ourselves is easier said than done. And I would assume that this is one of those things that like, we have to keep reminding ourselves like maybe when we start creating it, we're like, we got it, we're focused on them. But a couple of weeks later, we're back to talk. How do you how do you keep that business owner in check? Like maybe this week, their content? It's awesome, but they're creating something a few weeks from now. And you're like you're talking to yourself again? How do you keep them in that zone of staying centered on their audience?
Vanessa Alzate
Yeah, it's like that girl, pull yourself together a moment. Let's take a step back. So we actually create learner personas. Okay, tell
Jessica Rasdall
me about that. What does that act like? I don't know anything. And you didn't tell me about this in our intensive? Because I already know. Pretend? I don't know. Because I know our listeners don't tell us what the learner they weren't there with us. Unfortunately, they missed out a lot. They missed out on a lot. But what is a learning persona? And then unpack that for me? Yeah,
Vanessa Alzate
sure. So when you are in the beginning stages of creating training, or you know, even your talks, right, really understanding who the audience is going to be, and actually serving them. So we'll do surveys where I find out their demographics, what are some things that that motivate them? What are some challenges that they're currently facing? What job do they have? How do they prefer to learn? What kind of education background do they have? So depending on the content that's really important, and I even take it a step further. Well, I, where I do ask for some focus groups or just one on one interviews, nothing too long, 20 minutes or so. But I just like to do a couple of those to make sure I'm hearing from And using words that they're using, right? And then I go into Canva. And I, like map out who my person is I sit down, I look at everything. And I see like, I look at that bell curve. And I'm like, so these people in the middle, these are the ones that we're talking to the outliers. We can't, we're not going to appease everybody. And so here's the thing with training. And speaking, if you're trying to talk to everybody, you're going to talk to nobody. So these two at the ends, I'm not going to ignore them. But I'm going to understand that I'm not going to appease everyone, I need to talk to the bulk, which is that middle. And so once I have what that person looks like, like I give them a name, I go into like Google Images and find a stock photo, they get a photo, and I go into camp and I compile like, a resume. Looks like a resume. That's the template that I use. And I have their picture on there. They have their name, I've everything about them, right? I know who they are, what motivates them, and I print that out. And I put that on my wall. And I asked that, you know, we do that as well, as well at anchor training, like, I'm on we're creating content, we look back at that. And we're like, okay, Jessica, like, what would Jessica like? Is this going to speak to her? Or is this to like, above her her head? So I really make sure that we're constantly looking at that learner persona and asking like, how is she going to receive it. But then beyond that, I always Pidgin anytime I've had a training, launch and not be successful, it's because I didn't pilot it at first. clients don't want to do that, because they want to rush to the end to the end goal. But you do need to pilot it. Even if it's like a soft, small launch with a couple of people. You just have to make sure that you're piloting it, and you're getting that feedback from them. Another thing that I've personally done, I've asked people that know nothing about the content. And I asked them to actually take the training. So if I've done an elearning module, like I'll ask my husband to run through the training, and he'll point out to me, areas that he was confused about, or areas where like you've really like dug in on that. And like it was a little too much like you could you could I got it. And that's really helpful. He's not necessarily my ideal, like audience for all of them. But it just gives a fresh set of eyes, like the amount of reviews that my training get is a little bit a lot. But I need that those reviews to make sure that they're actually going to be well received when they're finally like launch.
Jessica Rasdall
I love that. So I've I've never launched a program in my years of business without doing like a beta first, because I'm just a firm believer of I'm too close, right? There's going to be holes, there's going to be stuff that comes easy to me that I'm not going to know needs more elaboration or more unpacking. I just, I think you're right, so many of us are ready to just rush to the end. And there's so much value in in that pilot program.
Vanessa Alzate
Yeah, I mean, I'm a big rusher. Don't get me wrong, I'm very impatient. I'm an Aries. So I'm like ready to get to the end. Like I almost launched something, I just had this summit, and I almost launched something right after the summit. Luckily, I watched my tarot reading by Chris grissini on Instagram, and he was like, slow down. It's gonna happen for you, but slow down, and we're launching it a little bit smarter. And really taking that time to prep, like to really create it. Um, and I know that like, as a business owner, like when you have this really great idea, you want to just like rush and do it but you have to do your due diligence, or you're going to either double your work later, we're gonna have like a fail, and people aren't gonna want to like rebook you and stuff like that, because they didn't, you didn't connect with them. You thought about yourself and what you wanted, because you wanted to rush, you didn't think about what they needed.
Jessica Rasdall
All of that. So when we are creating, you know, educational resources, courses, programs, even just content, anything like that, what are some of the biggest mistakes you see businesses making with that?
Vanessa Alzate
So besides what we've already touched upon, right, which is like not knowing who learning is speaking from like the business standpoint, and really being business first. I think that they're not accepting that the modern workforce is changing. A lot of businesses are not, and so they're staying behind. I work with Gen Z a lot. A lot. And I don't want to make this blanket statement for everybody because we're all different. Like I'm a millennial, I don't really adhere to like a lot of the things that they say about millennials. Like I feel like I'm a mix of Gen X and millennials, right?
Jessica Rasdall
Yeah, an older millennial.
Vanessa Alzate
Yeah, geriatric. It's fine. You said it might have my back hurts did I feel like I feel it. But I will say, there are just aspects of who they are as humans, that they don't want to sit in your brain training, you think that you have to give them everything and say, This is what you need to know from A to Z, they're gonna go and figure it out on their own, like you give them YouTube, they'll go and figure it out. But instead of you want to, like prescribe what they need to know. And there are some things that you have to know. But they don't need to know everything, or they locked down their training, right? Like you can't get to this training, or this next step until you've completed that, like, why we're talking about email etiquette. I'm an adult, I know how to not be a jerk on email. I don't really actually need to take those training.
Jessica Rasdall
I love that because I you know, that's something that I've seen a lot. He'll see it now like online course space that there's a lot of ego around, I want. I don't want them to go to this section until they fit like I want them to do it the way I designed it, but like having to realize like for us inside of the Academy, right? Yes, I want somebody to go through phase one. And then to phase two, I want them to go in order, because it's going to give them the best effect, you know, the best impact. But what if somebody has a speaking engagement coming up, I need them to jump to where they need to go right there. I want them to be able to get what they need when they need it. And I think there's a lot of that of the well, I designed it this way, this is the way that I know is best like this is in forgetting Well, what do they need right now. But
Vanessa Alzate
that's what I like about the program, right? And it's hair space one here, space 234. This is my recommendation for you to take that course, right, you almost give them like a pacing guide. Here's my recommendation, you start here and you go through, however we understand that things come up in life, or you may not need everything. If you have something about finding your niche. Well, I've listened to a million podcasts or a million books about finding my niche. I'm good. I know, I know what my niche is, I don't need to actually watch that. I Michael lean over it just as take us hear your perspective on it. But at the end of the day, nothing is new, no one is coming up with anything that's totally new. That's probably very similar, I can move on. And that's speaking to adults. And the difference between the adult learning and the school learning model, which is why I get a little hesitant about so many teachers transitioning into instructional design is we're turning, we're gonna turn adult learning back into school, or I'm going to tell you everything, and I'm gonna quiz you on it. And you're supposed to know, that's not how adults learn. That's not how we work, we opt in to what we want to and then we opt out when we don't. And if we're not interested, just like soon as right, if we're not interested in it, we're not listening, we're gonna move on, we're just gonna get frustrated. And then we're not going to complete your course because you kind of annoyed me. And I'm gonna ask for a refund.
Jessica Rasdall
Right? And so many course creators complain that or not even complain, this is the sad part. They don't complain, they have made it this now. Just Oh, that's just how it is that people don't complete programs that people don't go through that they buy them and they collect virtual dust. Right? And why do you think that is? Why do you think that so many people's programs are not actually that their customers are not actually going through them and using them?
Vanessa Alzate
There's two things that I think that course creators really need to think about first, are they come not completing it by your measure of completing it, but are they still seeing results? Because are they just opting into what they need to but they're still getting the same results. So you really need to track that.
Jessica Rasdall
That's a great point. keep getting Sorry, I've just
Vanessa Alzate
done what Yes, it's crazy. So I think that you definitely need to understand that. And you should be constantly reaching out and surveying your audience and your students, right and just find out the other thing. So you and I, before we jumped on here, start talking about learning styles, which is a total myth. People don't just learn in one way, FYI. Like I just I did a YouTube video about our learning styles real real. This is the most hotly debated topic in instructional design. Like if you want to start an argument, talk about that. Yeah, it gets hot, and in our world. And it's true, though. They're not necessarily real. What I think our real, our preferences, right? So like, I tried to Google how to do something like, Okay, this is really silly, so please don't judge me friends. I couldn't figure out how to do the like Instagram freeze frame to like filter effect. So I googled it. And a video popped up and I was really annoyed because I just wanted like a step by step instruction because like, I don't want to sit there and listen,
Jessica Rasdall
same. Same I want I want the list, give me the bullet point.
Vanessa Alzate
And so I think That's where people are missing, I think they're the easier thing for a lot, of course creators is to like, I'm going to sit in front of a camera, and I'm just going to talk, I'm going to tell you everything that you need to know. That might not be what's best for that learner. And that might not be what's best for that topic. So if you want to teach someone how to play guitar, you can't just sit there and tell them how to play guitar, they have to actually practice and you have to give them those opportunities to practice. Because if you're not, you're never going to learn. And that's what I like about the academy too, is that you have those opportunities to like practice in front of this safe space, like a safe community that just wants to uplift you and learn from you, too. You're giving us opportunities to practice speaking, me going through your videos, or you and I sitting on an intensive like, that was great, but it wasn't until I stepped on stage and tried to apply everything, then I'm like, Oh, crap, I need to go back and do this or do that. You have to just you have to practice. So I think that's really the reason people don't complete their courses is because you you stuck to one style. And it wasn't the best for that learning, so they couldn't grasp it. So they're like, I'm not going to get anything out of this. If I want to teach you how to edit a YouTube video, I probably should give you some sample files to work with, and give you some practice goals. I'll show you what it's supposed to look like. And now you go ahead and you try to you know, you try to do it yourself. And those types of things are really important in learning, and really important with adults.
Jessica Rasdall
I love that so much because like, it sounds so simple. Fortunately, it's not the case. And most things like that is teaching somebody to not need you anymore. And I think a lot of business owners get scared of that of like, I need them to keep needing me, I need them to keep investing in me. And it's like I don't I want to leave them better than I found them. I want to give them the tools and the wisdoms and the knowledge and the know how to be able to not just get the outcome, but to understand how to adjust it to improve in.
Vanessa Alzate
But then they're your biggest referrals if they leave you, right? If they got someone like in my business, the biggest way that we get clients is through word of mouth and referrals. And that is what you need, right? So you need your students to leave you and not need you. That being said, I think that a lot of course creators Don't think about the transformation. And like what's next. So I actually watched someone very intensely on YouTube, like I really love her content. And I thought that she did really well. And she's like struggling a little bit right now. And one of the things that I, I talk a lot about with my team about it. And as I said she's struggling because she never thought of 2.0. So her students left her. And then they went off and it's been so long they went out and they're like they they graduated from the program. They're doing well, they did. But now they're ready for the next step. And she didn't have that next step for them. And that's where that stripping the content comes back into play. It's like those three slides, everything else I need to know. But why can't that be the 2.0 course. And they don't necessarily leave you they leave that one program and they're ready to build on to the next one. And you can keep, like building those blocks for them.
Jessica Rasdall
I love that. I love that so much. So to all of our educational creators, here are all of our people who are creating content, if there was only one thing that you would want them to do differently, think differently. Keep top of mind when they're creating stuff this week, what would you want them to focus on?
Vanessa Alzate
Make sure they do that learner persona, and have that up and have that next to while you're creating your content and make sure you're speaking to her him. I also would love for you to look at your content and say is there a better way I could be training this, it's not the easiest way, the easiest ways for you to do a video and just talk to it or a PowerPoint and you have audio to it. That's the easy way to get the information across. That's where I get hesitancy like creating my course it's like, I know it's going to be a longer process because I have a lot of things that I want to incorporate that are a little bit different than what you would normally see. Yes, it'll it might take me a little bit longer, but the outcomes will be better. Because I really was putting the learner first and keeping them at the heart of my training.
Jessica Rasdall
I love all of that. And I don't think this is talked about a lot. Especially in the entrepreneurial space. Like we're taught how to. There's so many resources for how to market your your educational resources, but there's very little teaching you how to create something that is delivering real transformation. So I just appreciate you so much sharing all of your wisdom and knowledge with us so that we can create better we can serve better we can change our industries. And then for our listeners who want to know more Who want to dive into this? Where can they find you? And then tell us I think you have something that will help us get started.
Vanessa Alzate
Absolutely. So you could find me on LinkedIn, Vanessa Ezzati, or you could find me on Instagram where I'm trying to be show up a lot more. So that's at anchored and ch o r Ed training are at Vanessa anchored. That's really the more fun Instagram. You'll catch me like on my my walk chats or in my Asana, having conversation, lots of thoughts about life. But yes, I also have an instructional design jumpstart for you all to download. It's free. It's like a 10 page document that will help you go through that learner persona process. And really jumpstart your next instructional design project, whether it's for yourself or your company, like this can be applied to onboarding your own employees, it's really applicable to so many areas.
Jessica Rasdall
I love it so much. I will link that in the show notes so that you can easily click and follow Vanessa and binge all her things and grab this resource because you have so much knowledge to share as a subject matter expert, but we want to make sure we are sharing this in a way that actually serves our body. Thank you so much for tuning in to today's episode of The speak to scale podcast. It would mean the world to us if you could just take a second and head on over to iTunes and leave us a review. Your support of this show allows us to continue creating this content for you each and every week. And we appreciate your reviews and you sharing about the show more than you know. As always, I will be over here cheering you on friend. I'll see you next week for another episode of The speak to scale podcast.
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